Product placement advertising

jane_e · 20-09-11 13:44:20

Wow, so much to respond too. It's amazing what happens when you sleep while half the world is awake.

Viva wrote:

But I do know that each and every one of us who works here, and many of the contributors who have participated for ideological reasons, go into the world and bring those ideals with them every day, and that's not nothing.

I want to print this out and hang it on the wall above my desk. I may in fact do just that--right now.

The topic of exposure is an interesting one I wonder how many contributors actually know how many people will be viewing their contributions before they start (if they get off on understanding data trends like me) checking their stats page. All it takes is a computer and a credit card to join this semi-exclusive club. With YouTube videos of cats playing with birds getting literally million of views I was surprised that videos on this site are viewed by only a few thousand. If Feck made it big and say 10,000 people started digging into the archives 5 years from now, would I want my video removed? Would it feel the same as it does now while my contributions are semi-private? I'm not sure... I guess the same could be said for advertising.

Bobby wrote:

That clip was not about dismissing the idea of reaching people in a new way, I'm all for a TED talk, how does one go about that?

So crazily enough a guy I know (who coincidentally used to be my boss) just did a TEDx talk. George Roter is an amazing guy, but he's not any more amazing than the people around here. I'm sure someone could get on. I think the key is to get your name out there and have it associated with new, smart, and innovative views about a particular topic. Which leads me nicely into my next follow up....

DomC wrote:

Adult sex education is another issue entirely, though, and I think the world is still sorely lacking in adequate sex education in that regard. I like the idea of a blog written by a group of women under the Feck banner, that could serve as a sounding board for non-fiction writing about sex, including sex education, etc.

DomC, you are quickly usruping Blissed as my favorite forum contributor. I'm sorry Blissed -- it's only because of the whole who has the exclusive rights to the Snuggie Spoon thing.

I didn't mean to get into the realm of adolescent sex education. Kids are complicated. The women in my example should have been 27 or 37. This idea of partnering with sex shops came to me after my sister I paid $20 (each!) for what turned out to be a very uninformative workshop on Masturbation, for her. I can honestly say that by hanging around the forums and watching a few videos I have learned more about sex...and other stuff than I could have previously imagined. When I stared reading posts I had to Google "sex-positive". True story.

I love the idea of a Feck blog. Something that is accessible to everyone, informative, funny, and fun. Something PG13 that you could tell your friends about. It would also help to position Feck a leader in conversations about ethical erotica and mainstream porn. There are so many misconceptions about sex and the sex industry that underlie information in the media and in our day-to-day conversations. It would be great to see more of the ideas and ideals expressed in this forum in letters to the editor, on Facebook news feeds and Forbes Magazines (Forbes? Why not?).

Richard, this is two votes now for a Feck blog. I hope you are keeping track. On the topic of Richard...

Viva wrote:

Richard is really on it when it comes to tracking down leaked videos and he inspires trust on that level for me.

It's worth mentioning that Richard protects the work that contributors do here in ways that most contributors, myself included, can't even imagine. He does a terrible job of explaining it, but he does it. He may never make enough money to buy me a steam train as a result...but I may, maaaay get over it...eventually.

blissed · 20-09-11 14:39:25

Cindy Gallop has done a TED talk http://blog.ted.com/2009/12/02/cindy_gallop_ma/

and she's posted in this forum http://forum.ifeelmyself.com/forum/view … 897#p56897

She might nominate Viva to do a TED talk. (I have seen a shared stage at TED with 2 or 3 people and that works too) I think if you can rap and do poetry in front of an audience you can do a TED talk And people at TED help you and Cindy can advise you too. Melbourne free university is good to get involved with when developing and planning a TED talk http://melbournefreeuniversity.org/?p=1585
Yeah ask Cindy Gallop if she'll nominate you and go for it

TED nomination form
http://www.ted.com/nominate/speaker

Jane about the sex spoon thing, my lawyer advised me to consult with them 1st before I discuss rights because they said I'm too sappy and I give everything away.

Feck sex education is for adults 18 plus. I think society is so erotically illiterate that when we think of sex education we think of the basics so think of adolescence. With other fields you have the usually fairly well established basics, then the next stage, and the next with the information getting more and more debatable as the true ecology of the subject is revealed. Feck does reveal it's part of that ecology really well (and that' revelation is the effect it's had on all of us) because it's constantly documenting it with solo and real partner videos but also letting those experiences inform performance, evident in beautiful videos like seething skin. So it's not about just documenting from the outside but creative contributing too. a bit like singer songwriting rather than just singing. It's more the beatles than the x factor.

Moldenle I think you were joking when you said your video is artistic. It highlights the need for adult sex education and why IFM exists. What a fucking insult to that woman that her own genuine reaction to her own amazing experience isn't deemed good enough and has to be replaced with misrepresentational over acting. Acting sex is fine BTW if it's a genuine reflection of sexuality. Bad acting's not a crime but when it's nearly all there is available, that is a crime. Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr I think it gets me angry because it's a tiny bit like old hollywood rascism and how that's ordered actors to misrepresent themselves with childish caricature. (I have a Korean freind who hates lost in translation)

Viva google took me to the 9 year old wrestler and all I can say is what's wrong with that guy, that little girl should've been a total pushover she's obviously super talented, I want her as my body guard

.

Last edited by blissed (20-09-11 15:23:09)

jane_e · 20-09-11 15:28:45

The next TED conference is about RADICAL OPENNESS!!!

How fitting is that??

I don't think that anyone special actually has to nominate a speaker. Viva? Gala? Bobby? Richard? Who want's to take the stage? Also, just throwing it out there but Roe would totally get my vote if she was interested...

I feel like this idea is crazy, but so crazy that it might just work.

blissed · 20-09-11 16:06:28

Yeah that is an apt theme!!!

I just thought the only drawback with it is the complete out thereness of TED talks. If you get an email from your uncle "Gramps says you've done a TED talk about porn!!, what's that all about, I thought you worked for a night club and dance workshop" such a web of lies ha ha

It has to be someone who's totally out there with this subject. yet can communicate. If we say no there is no-one then we concede it's this kind of judgemental oppression from a sex negative society that perpetuates itself. A barrier all the women from the Dodson and Ross bodysex group have very bravely broken through.

http://dodsonandross.com/blogs/carlin-r … hese-women

So the talk has to be given by someone who's happily out there with a talk that includes the role of Feck and presents the notions of sex positivity, and there may be a few candidates there associated with the Melbourne free university. Yeah lots of posibilities.

.

Last edited by blissed (20-09-11 20:16:14)

domC · 20-09-11 22:35:35

I really need to go to work, but I want to get this down quickly: while I think adult sex education is really important, I cannot stress how much more important it is to get it right with teenagers. So many of our attitudes about sex develop during that critical period of adolescence and we still expect kids to just "pick it up as they go along" and to some extent, we literally rely on children's increased exposure to pornography and the internet to do the job for us. That's part of the reason we have young men and women having warped ideas about what sex is and isn't and it also feeds into the idea that a site like this is exceptional and different, because IFM relies on appealing to a minority rather than the majority and can market itself as a point of difference.

Part of sex education for adults is about correcting ideas that have been perpetuated since a person's adolescence and that can be tricky, because it means well established notions about sex and sexuality need to be challenged before new ideas can really be explored. In many cases, we have years of unfucking to do, before we can even begin to teach people to feel comfortable about sex and sexuality.

I had a conversation with a fifteen year old girl yesterday who told me that just that morning she was exposed to her first (FIRST) bit of sex-ed in her biology class and her mind literally imploded because she had vaguely known that an erect penis gets hard but not that it actually gets hard and moves up (they didn't tell her that some can have a sideways tilt, also, but after the shock she had, I guess it's baby-steps). As the adult in the conversation, I had twenty million delicate issues I had to consider about engaging in any kind of sexual discussion with her or attempting to help right some of her misconceptions because it was inappropriate for me to do so and the complexities of all the rules and regulations about what you can and can't tell minors is infuriating and a big part of the problem. This girl wasn't wilfully naive or sheltered, but she was clearly uncomfortable talking about sex and she still thought of it as something disgusting and closeted. I can't even imagine how she will feel in ten years time.

blissed · 21-09-11 01:45:54

I know it sounds like an awkward situation but where the personal advise ran out I'd try and remember to tell her about Scarleteen http://www.scarleteen.com/

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viva · 21-09-11 02:10:47

One thing I am tired of is having to make excuses. I'm tired of brashly saying "I make porn" - because I think hiding it is immature - and then scooting back to cover up my tracks by qualifying my statement - "but it's not that commercial shit, you know, we call it ethical erotica, and it's honest, you know, it's real..." and then I justify myself further - "I love my job, I work with this amazing team of people.." and by the time I'm done I wish I'd stopped at "I make porn."

Okay. So yes, it would be fantastic, in my lifetime, to actually see a shift in the consciousness of what porn is, what it can be. To those who think the peeps is still and forever too grounded in them traditional and religulous ways, just take a poll of the young folks - ask them which streaming porn tube site is the best. Most of them are likely to have an opinion, yes even the ladies, even if it takes a couple of beers to get it out of them. So the world is changing, slowly but surely, and thanks to many many sassy folks - and a lil thing called the web - I expect to one day be able to talk about porn the way I can talk about food - a broad, interesting category in which there are many gross things and also many beautifully made and yummy things.

Okay maybe that's the TED talk intro. ha.

Um, I will just put this out there - when it comes to spreading the word, we are all equally capable and responsible. We are a tiny team at Feck and we've got our hands full 40 hrs a week - on the weekends we like to bake pies, cuddle our stuffed dragons and go fishing down by the river. What about you guys? If somebody gets a collaborative blog together, for instance, I assure you that I will contribute. I see at least 5 distinct and powerful voices which spin well-formed, intelligent opinions into this forum daily. Why not go more public if you're passionate - not necessarily under Feck - but right alongside it?

richard · 21-09-11 05:52:40

jane_e wrote:

The next TED conference is about RADICAL OPENNESS!!!
How fitting is that??
I don't think that anyone special actually has to nominate a speaker. Viva? Gala? Bobby? Richard? Who want's to take the stage?

Why Jane, an obvious choice, so good of you to volunteer!

domC · 21-09-11 07:50:50

Blissed: Scarleteen is an excellent resource and I find it really heartening that it continues well over a decade after it was first released. Unfortunately, though, I was in no position to give any guidance to this girl, not even to suggest she look at a site like Scarleteen. That's the issue, really - it's rarely appropriate for adults to give sex advice to children, even if they are older teenagers, even if they are already engaging in sexual activities. There is a huge divide between my personal beliefs and interests in talking about sex and sexuality on the level with anyone who wants to know and what I actually do on a day to day basis (which is to clam up, because it is not my place to have these discussions). Resources like Scarleteen are brilliant and are often things kids stumble on without an adult directing them (some porn websites have a link to it on their age verification pages), but generally it is not appropriate for people other than immediate family and peers to point minors towards sex education. There's still a lot of responsibility that falls on family to educate their children adequately about more than just the mechanical shit they tell you in a sex-ed class. Huge gaps in knowledge become apparent when kids become adults - often in frightening ways (like have kids ever really had discussions about consent?)

Clearly this is something I've been churning over in my mind for a while now.

Viva: trust me, the temptation to put some kind of blog together is strong, though like most everyone here, I also have a full load at the moment and even weekends are a luxury I rarely have.

Richard, smooth and subtle as usual.

blissed · 21-09-11 14:32:47

richard wrote:

jane_e wrote:
The next TED conference is about RADICAL OPENNESS!!!
How fitting is that??
I don't think that anyone special actually has to nominate a speaker. Viva? Gala? Bobby? Richard? Who want's to take the stage?
Why Jane, an obvious choice, so good of you to volunteer!

Richard your really the obvious 1st candidate. Feck being your company. Though that makes you the most vulnerable to being demonised with perhaps the biggest consequences if you stick your neck out publicly.

You could do the whole talk in the dark using hand shadow puppetry If you want me to do the TED talk that's exactly how I'd do it. Nothing wrong with doing that in a conference about radical openness

Actually isn't this the whole point of the talk. Wouldn't doing the talk off stage visually anonymous and pseudonymously (Well I think that's a word! with slides and video be a good way of expressing that none of us can be open yet. And isn't that part of the whole point and need for the talk? If we could all be open and give the talk to extended family applause, in that kind of society there'd be no need to give the talk in the first place.

The only person who I can think of who's out in the open completely and who though having a mercurial past now cites Feck as a positive influence on her life and work, and who is ready to participate in the sex party when she returns to Aus in October is Liandra Dahl. Gala you might want to do the talk, and Viva you might at the beginning of your public journey. Carlin Ross is at the end of hers. Her journey started when she met Betty Dodson and not everyones destination (sorry about the metaphor:) is complete public openness.

.

Last edited by blissed (21-09-11 22:28:51)

jane_e · 22-09-11 14:14:59

blissed wrote:

richard wrote:
jane_e wrote:
The next TED conference is about RADICAL OPENNESS!!!
How fitting is that??
I don't think that anyone special actually has to nominate a speaker. Viva? Gala? Bobby? Richard? Who want's to take the stage?
Why Jane, an obvious choice, so good of you to volunteer!
Richard your really the obvious 1st candidate. Feck being your company. Though that makes you the most vulnerable to being demonised with perhaps the biggest consequences if you stick your neck out publicly.

Ha. Richard, you clearly have not watched my Beautiful Agony confession in which despite doing a lot of very convincing hand waving I mostly just look like I'm trying to think to much about what I just said, what I'm going to say, and what I wished I said the whole time I'm talking...and this is just in the first 16 seconds, which is about the maximum amount of patience I have for watching people (myself included apparently) talk. I agree with Blissed. You are the most obvious candidate. I would co-host, but only because someone haaaaass to be the the pretty one.

Viva wrote:

I'm tired of brashly saying "I make porn" - because I think hiding it is immature - and then scooting back to cover up my tracks by qualifying my statement - "but it's not that commercial shit, you know, we call it ethical erotica, and it's honest, you know, it's real..." and then I justify myself further - "I love my job, I work with this amazing team of people.." and by the time I'm done I wish I'd stopped at "I make porn."

There is something interesting about the topic of outness and porn and this site. As someone who failed out of ballet, can't remember a drink order longer than one, or walk in anything higher than "flat" I've been spinning a rather un-suspicious web of lies. In many ways this makes it easier to come out, but...big but here, only after I have established who I am. It is much harder to tell someone I made porn if they don't also know that I design drinking water distribution systems. The juxtaposition of these two different "jobs" sets me up for a very different kind of public reaction than contributor in example No. 1 who's "Gramps" thinks that she works at a night club. Is this fair? Or right? Not really. Viva, unfortunately, it seems like as you pointed out none of us can just stop at or start with "I make porn".

Although it might make for a good TED Talk opening line....You should write that one down Richard.

*Edited just to add in Viva's quotation--which after the triple quote I was just to lazy to put in the first time.

Last edited by jane_e (22-09-11 15:11:44)

viva · 23-09-11 02:03:08

Bravo on that epic triple quote Jane!

Aw man, actually being naked on the internet is a whole other thing for me. Either I'm out without qualifiers, or I'm so far up the closet's ass, I'm in Narnia. It's nice there, my dad's there.

It's a more common situation for me that's complicated - that simple, friendly, everyday question - "So, what do you do?" So, generally I don't want to start that hilarious conversation with every dude who makes me coffee or friend of a friend in from england or whatnot, usually I can get away with "oh, I work with computers and images and art and things" and if they push, "we have websites, and people send in their work for us to put up" - I used to lie and say shit about some web art magazine, but lying is boring - but if they push after that, man, they're in for the whole kit and kaboodle, I go all slut walk on their asses.

Still not everyone's looking for a deep conversation about sex porn and pussy first thing in the morning, and I respect that. it's just kind of hard to find the middle ground, because just answering, I make porn, or I make erotica, or I'm an image editor and writer for a porn company - feels good, for being all simple and true, and proud and non-apologetic, but without qualifiers, it kinda leaves people floundering.

It feels like I owe people an explanation. I guess this is even more complicated for the folk primarily employed as sex-workers. Do you lie? Do you make excuses? Do you let 'em have it? Aren't we sometimes bored of talking about our jobs? Sex work especially - such a big deal to civilians. Is it a girl's job to educate every motherfucker who asks what she does about the joys of free will and femininity? How tiring. This is why my friends and I call sex workers secretaries - nobody asks twice when you say you're a secretary.

aven frey · 23-09-11 03:31:09

I generally tell people I work in design and photography and if they delve I direct converstation to my personal art which involves dead things so that's usually enough to make them back off. I do however drop in corrections or normalised (rather than hysterical) views of the sex industry when appropiate.

Jane, I also failed out of ballet, I can't remember my phone number let alone a drink order and heels cause a special kind of anxiety that can't be explained but I worked as a dancer for nearly a year. I did fall over a lot and I was shit but really that didn't seem to matter as far as making money! More often than not the ladies I worked with had other careers or goals, you'd be suprised how many PHD candidates can swing upside down on a pole. I've tended to find that those who do make sex work their career are usually really amazing at high kicking, with grace and agility, presumptions and the like in the face. Unlike me, I just accidently high kicked, with neither grace nor agility some poor dude in the front row one time. He took it in good humour and bought a dance. He was a good fellow with a hard head!

carstuff1000 · 23-09-11 10:11:04

There are quite a few jobs, where it would not be prudent to tell what you do for a living. Some may cause embarrassment, some may endanger you, your family or your possessions. E.G undercover police, benefit agency investigator, banker (because of the latest financial problems), abortionist, animal research or simple street cleaner (embarrassment). Hope this post is not too serious for the forum. Maybe we should start a thread GUESS MY JOB !

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