#1 25-05-06 09:50:18

Elfman

Member

From: Yorkshire

Registered: 17-03-06

Posts: 700

Thanks Lia And Warmtouch

I didn't want to post this on the "Is this forum the norm" thread where it probably belongs because I didn't want to Troll and interupt the flow there but I just wanted to thank Lia and Warmtouch for their fascinating and well written dialogue on the slash  phenomenon.  (Didn't understand it all but I did my best to keep up).  I wonder if there has ever been such an erodite conversation on the pages of an "adult" site before?  I've never seen one.

Thanks guys.

Elfman.

Last edited by Elfman (25-05-06 11:32:16)

Burlesque

Member

From: Sweden

Registered: 04-05-06

Posts: 1,368

Re: Thanks Lia And Warmtouch

Fascinating stuff, indeed. Slash, the psychological and practical realities of prostitution, some good old academia-bashing (with which I agree wholheartedly), and witty verbosity galore - I could read this stuff all day.

Burlesque.

---

Maintain a sense of humour about it, whatever "it" is.

"Max Fan Club" Head of Security and In-house Sycophant. (Who says evil can't be a full-time occupation?)

Warmtouch

Member

From: Southern England

Registered: 29-03-06

Posts: 326

Re: Thanks Lia And Warmtouch

Well, I'm a proto-academic who may be joining the academy in a big way soon, but I'm also an engineer, so there's a lot less room for bullshit. Things have to actually work, or you don't pass the class, to wit:

Your bridge falls down: Fail
Your bridge stands up but falls down in a wind: D
Your bridge stands up but falls down under a load: C
Your bridge stands up and carries its required load: B
Your bridge stands up, carries more than its required load, and uses fewer materials than usual: A

This is for an introductory class, mind you. By graduation your bridge has to stand up under all reasonable conditions just to pass.

I'd love to find a way to apply those sorts of standards to literary criticism.

Burlesque

Member

From: Sweden

Registered: 04-05-06

Posts: 1,368

Re: Thanks Lia And Warmtouch

Well, I'm a proto-academic who may be joining the academy in a big way soon, but I'm also an engineer, so there's a lot less room for bullshit. Things have to actually work, or you don't pass the class, to wit:

Your bridge falls down: Fail
Your bridge stands up but falls down in a wind: D
Your bridge stands up but falls down under a load: C
Your bridge stands up and carries its required load: B
Your bridge stands up, carries more than its required load, and uses fewer materials than usual: A

This is for an introductory class, mind you. By graduation your bridge has to stand up under all reasonable conditions just to pass.

I'd love to find a way to apply those sorts of standards to literary criticism.

Yes that would simplify matters a great deal, wouldn't it?

Burlesque

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Maintain a sense of humour about it, whatever "it" is.

"Max Fan Club" Head of Security and In-house Sycophant. (Who says evil can't be a full-time occupation?)

Lia

Member

Registered: 24-04-06

Posts: 214

Re: Thanks Lia And Warmtouch

We aim to please.

Especially when it, er, concerns gay fandom and hookers.

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“The trouble is I’m really a puritan at heart. All  pornographers are puritans.”
“You are certainly not a pornographer,” he said.
“No, but it sounded good. I like those two p’s.
The alliteration.”

blissed

Member

From: The bus station of the future

Registered: 17-03-06

Posts: 5,622

Re: Thanks Lia And Warmtouch

Your bridge falls down: Fail
Your bridge stands up but falls down in a wind: D
Your bridge stands up but falls down under a load: C
Your bridge stands up and carries its required load: B
Your bridge stands up, carries more than its required load, and uses fewer materials than usual: A

This is for an introductory class, mind you. By graduation your bridge has to stand up under all reasonable conditions just to pass.

I'd love to find a way to apply those sorts of standards to literary criticism.

I think publishers try to £$%€
http://www.nytimes.com/pages/books/best … index.html

.

Last edited by blissed (25-05-06 23:54:47)

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(Self made tycoon and independant financial advisor to the stars)

aven frey

Video editor

Registered: 24-02-06

Posts: 2,577

Website

Re: Thanks Lia And Warmtouch

Yes I have to agree - awesome thread thankyou!! Expecially Lia, we all should send her monies to help pay off her (I'm expecting) substantial hecs debt!!

Lia

Member

Registered: 24-04-06

Posts: 214

Re: Thanks Lia And Warmtouch

Yes I have to agree - awesome thread thankyou!! Expecially Lia, we all should send her monies to help pay off her (I'm expecting) substantial hecs debt!!

Damn bloody straight! Generous donations can be made via Paypal and through the non-HECS-affiliated Agent Provocateur lingerie website.

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“The trouble is I’m really a puritan at heart. All  pornographers are puritans.”
“You are certainly not a pornographer,” he said.
“No, but it sounded good. I like those two p’s.
The alliteration.”

cynicism

Member

Registered: 17-03-06

Posts: 180

Re: Thanks Lia And Warmtouch

Well, I'm a proto-academic who may be joining the academy in a big way soon, but I'm also an engineer, so there's a lot less room for bullshit. Things have to actually work, or you don't pass the class, to wit:

Your bridge falls down: Fail
Your bridge stands up but falls down in a wind: D
Your bridge stands up but falls down under a load: C
Your bridge stands up and carries its required load: B
Your bridge stands up, carries more than its required load, and uses fewer materials than usual: A

This is for an introductory class, mind you. By graduation your bridge has to stand up under all reasonable conditions just to pass.

I'd love to find a way to apply those sorts of standards to literary criticism.

I'd heard it phrased somewhat differently: "Anyone can build a bridge that stands up, but only a civil engineer can build one that JUST stands up".

greycat

Member

Registered: 04-06-06

Posts: 94

Re: Thanks Lia And Warmtouch

lia, what is hecs?  academic terminology there? i am an academic (ducks, looks out from under the table, so far no injury) but the ole' us system is different, i.e. no 'diploma' as an indication of achievement shorter than, or different than, a baccalaureate or masters degree? is that what it is?  is an HD a diploma?

perhaps the 'grade' criteria should be applied to the writers, not the critics. someone always hates any given critic's opinion. but at least a few writers gain wide approval. so lets see:

Fail - illegible, grammer unintelligible
D - legible, unfortunately
C - ok for airline magazines (C- = discount airlines, C= decent airlines in bankruptcy, C+ = actually flying AND making a bit of money)
B - sells at bookstores, questionable if author ever makes any money though
A - actually good, majority of critics agree; alternately: grammar may be unintelligible but no one knows (exposing my failed memory: was it Jack Kerouac or neil cassidy or alan ginsberg who wrote nonstop on a roll of paper without punctuation or capitalization)

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(allegedly) amusing signature deleted until further notice.

cynicism

Member

Registered: 17-03-06

Posts: 180

Re: Thanks Lia And Warmtouch

lia, what is hecs?  academic terminology there? i am an academic (ducks, looks out from under the table, so far no injury) but the ole' us system is different, i.e. no 'diploma' as an indication of achievement shorter than, or different than, a baccalaureate or masters degree? is that what it is?  is an HD a diploma?

hecs = HECS = Higher Education Contribution Scheme = a government version of student loans for tuition (putting it in US terms). You take a university course, paying nothing for tuition, then they take it out of your salary for years afterwards (you pay more tax than other people do until your debt is paid off).

HD = High Distinction - the highest mark you can get on an essay or thesis - I think the scale goes: fail, pass, credit, distinction, high distinction. Roughly equivalent, in US terms, to F, D, C, B, A.

We do have diplomas, but usually only for courses shorter than a bachelor's degree. A diploma course might be 2 years, with the bachelor's degree being 3. or 3 vs 4. Diplomas are rarer here. Also, we don't get a diploma at the end of high school, nor do we "graduate" from high school.

bodyhead

Member

From: Boudicca country, UK

Registered: 03-06-06

Posts: 211

Re: Thanks Lia And Warmtouch

Warmtouch, I convict you of being an archetypal British analytical thinker! (smiling). Truth is more than just commonsense, and any worthwhile essay must contain an element of excess and exaggeration. Unlike a bridge, thought doesn't proceed in a single direction.
There is a lot of bullshit around though.

I'm going to print off your discussion with Lia so I can read it properly. I recently helped a friend of a friend proof-read her research thesis on the clients of Thai sex workers in an Australian city, and much of what you and Lia said confirmed her experience and understanding.
She wrote a lot about 'liminal states, which is a fascinating area of study.

I'll shut up now.

Last edited by bodyhead (13-06-06 05:51:05)

Siobhan

Member

Registered: 15-06-06

Posts: 823

Re: Thanks Lia And Warmtouch

A - actually good, majority of critics agree; alternately: grammar may be unintelligible but no one knows (exposing my failed memory: was it Jack Kerouac or neil cassidy or alan ginsberg who wrote nonstop on a roll of paper without punctuation or capitalization)

It was Kerouac, on a roll with On the Road.

Would you also add to the conditions of an "A" grade that it is likely to sell as many as 187 copies?

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Under all speech that is good for any-thing there lies a silence that is better.  Silence is as deep as Eternity;  speech is as shallow as Time.--Thomas Carlysle